Last week I started in on the core classes, which garnered a lot of discussion. I’ll definitely be going back and revising them soon (they’re already in the works in my design document.)
So here’s what I think of as the next step, or at least a defining portion of the next step: at-wills. At-will powers accomplish a few important things in the game. They serve as the powers you will use the most, and throughout your entire career adventuring. They are the fall backs when you don’t want to use any of your encounter or dailies (expendable resources) and are more all-purpose.
But in 4e, those are also the powers you will be using every round in combat. They’re the go-to. You will probably use one of them at least once per combat. In a Modern game, that’s not necessarily the case. You rarely see the same move done in every scene.
The focus, then, are just moves that a character can always try and perform. Unlike a per scene or per session power, which will be designed to fill a certain dramatic role a certain number of times per game, at-wills can happen when needed. Not only that, but non-combat at-wills (or at least, non-encounter at-wills) are tough since you don’t want them to just be “spammed” over and over again, for whatever skill or situation. You want there to be a choice to use them.
The other big thing when working on how at-wills work is that I want to encourage multiclassing. Thus, there’s just a big pool of at-wills that anyone can take, no matter what class you are. Each at-will has an effect like expected, and then an extra “kicker” for the different classes, two for each at-will. Then a feat would be available to count as a different class for the purposes of at-will and begin the multiclass path.
A lot of introduction, I know, but it’s a tough issue. Here are some samples of what I’ve come up with. Do note that several of them duplicate abilities in 4e: these are ones that make sense for fantasy adventurers to be able to do all the time and ordinary people do only with training.
Shove
Standard Action
Str vs. Reflex
Hit: You push the target a step.
Strong Hero: You also deal your Str mod damage to the target.
Tough Hero: You instead push the target a short distance.
Grapple
Standard Action
Str vs. Reflex
Hit: You grab the target.
Strong Hero: Each turn that you maintain the grab, you deal damage equal to your Str mod.
Tough Hero: The target takes a penalty to all checks equal to your Con mod.
Dash
Move Action
You move a medium distance and take a -5 penalty to all your checks this turn.
Fast Hero: You can instead move a long distance.
Tough Hero: The penalty to your checks is reduced by your Con mod (up to +0).
Distract
Standard Action
Cha vs. Will
Hit: The target can only take one action on its next turn.
Smart Hero: The next check against the target receives a bonus equal to your Int mod.
Charismatic Hero: The next check made by the target in the next turn receive a penalty equal to your Cha mod.
Study Weakness
Standard Action
Int vs. Fort
Standard Action
Target: One creature in close range
Hit: The target grants combat advantage to your allies until the beginning of you next turn.
Smart Hero: Any allies that hit the target with an attack also deal extra damage equal to your Int mod.
Dedicated Hero: The attack bonus for combat advantage is equal to your 1 + Wis mod instead of the normal +2.
Feint
Cha vs Will
Move Action
Target an enemy engaged with you.
Hit: You have combat advantage against the target until the end of your turn.
Fast Hero: If you hit the target this turn, their initiative count drops to the bottom of the list.
Charismatic Hero: The target takes a penalty to Will equal to our Cha mod.
Aim
Move Action
You gain a +1 bonus to your next attack roll with a ranged weapon this turn.
Smart Hero: You critical on the attack from 19-20.
Fast Hero: The bonus is instead equal to your Dex mod.
Taunt
Cha vs Will
Hit: You mark the target until the end of your next turn.
Dedicated Hero: You gain a bonus to your Reflex equal to your Wis mod against the target.
Charismatic Hero: The target moves towards you.
Breather
Move Action
Any hit points you gain until the beginning of your next turn are increased by 2.
Dedicated Hero: Instead gain extra HP equal to your 1+Wis mod.
Tough Hero: In addition gain temporary HP equal to your Con mod.
Trip
Standard Action
Str vs Reflex
Hit: The target is knocked prone.
Strong Hero: The target also takes damage equal to your Str mod.
Fast Hero: The target must spend a Standard action to stand next turn.
Duck
Immediate Interrupt
Trigger: You are hit by an attack that targets Reflex and you have cover.
Effect: You gain superior cover and fall prone.
Fast Hero: On your next turn, you can stand up as a minor action.
Smart Hero: You can roll a short distance after the attack resolves.
Still working on them of course, and looking forward to some suggestions. Next week: A sampling of Per Scene and Per Session powers… which are a bit different.
Really interesting to make them all more utility-power-ish instead of direct damage dealers. Can’t wait to see some of the “encounters” and “dailies” to see how things mix.
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Interesting direction to take, so you’re figuring on characters using their basic attacks most of the time, and at-wills for utility effects? Will they still be limited to just two or three of these? Seems like quite the big change.
Feint and Aim gonna be spammed a lot, ‘cause they are move actions. 4e encourage movement on battlefield, not standing and hitting, but what about your abstract combat? Maybe make them more powerful, but Per Scene? Or standard actions but “until the end of next turn”? Or just build them in other powers, i.e. Accurate Attack: Dex + 1 vs. AC, or something.
Well, I don’t see whole picture here, but is it valuable option to trade move for +1, or it’s just be full-round action (Faint/Aim + Attack) constantly?
What type of action is Taunt?
I don’t get Breather — it’s goal to team tactic: I heal you, you help me healing yourself?
Change Duck to Per Scene and make it little bit more powerful: add “and you have cover in reach (close range?)”. It’s feel more like one time opportunity cinematic stunt, and don’t belong to at-will powers, IMHO.
And I don’t see balance in “kickers” — some classes get more, some less.
Interesting stuff. I do like the idea of someone giving up a weapon-damage power in return for a usable technique; but at the same time that’s the biggest problem I have with this idea. It feels like these would make 4E regress to the one-trick-pony combats of 3.x D&D.
In my own game, I might create a second 1st-level encounter power slot that can only be filled by one of these. That way you’d end up with a unique or “signature” move, that adheres to the “more combat options” philosophy of 4th Edition D&D.
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@Andrew: I don’t see feint and aim being “spammed” because they are move actions, meaning you have to stand still to do them. Sure if you stand still it’s reasonable that you can aim and therefore shoot better, the same with feint, but having to be stationary to use them is the balance there. Where I think it becomes fun is if you were to play a Fast Hero you can move as a minor action sometimes and then run, aim, and shoot all at once (just like a Fast Hero should be able to). There will most likely be more powerful versions of these powers as well in the per scene / session powers, but that doesn’t preclude a minor bonus for standing still and aiming being an option for all modern characters.
Breather makes sense in a modern context as well, if you’re resting then spending a healing surge or someone administering first aid to you is more effective. Again I like how this illustrates the adversity such as moving and shooting is less effective, doing anything and trying to heal is less effective as well.
My big concern comes from how many at-will powers a hero might get, and that you could feasibly have a hero who cannot grab a target at all or cannot shove someone, but Dave knows about these concerns already so I imagine we’ll see something addressing them.
@Bartoneus: I said I don’t have whole picture: I don’t know how valuable will be actual movement in abstract combat. Also I said that 4e encourage movement on battlefield, so all what move action powers do is some form of movement — if The 4th Power different in that aspect, it must be clarified then we get to that.
The Game: I rather like the direction that you’ve gone here. Having the “Kicker” feature helps outline the strengths of the different classes, but seems like it will allow for a good variety of build options.
Sian and Saragon did touch upon a concern that I share, which is that without any Weapon At-Wills there is going to be plenty of movement, forced movement, grabs, conditions and buffs, but when someone wants to shoot a gun or throw a punch they’re going to default to a Basic Attack, which i think takes a lot of the flavor out of 4e combat. I would really like to see some At-Wills like Twin Strike or Scorching Burst turn into things like Double Tap or Autofire which could be available to everyone who wants to use a Firearm, but would have kickers for to help make Soldier, Gangster or other combat orient archetypes, without forcing them to use weaker Basic Attacks constantly.
Sian: Correct, though Per Scene/Per Session are even more utility. It is a big change, though I could be talked out of some of it.
Andrew: Feint right now is in 4e, just as a skill thing and not a power, so I’m not quite as worried about that one. Aim might be used often with ranged attacks, but that may be OK. I’m still hoping that people will be moving around, just incentivized in different ways. I’ll have to be careful about that. And I agree Duck should be Per Scene, though I do have a “Block with stuff” power that I’m considering getting back to At-Will.
Also, that’s not all the powers, just the ones I’ve hammered out enough. There will be an equal amount of kickers for each class.
Bartoneus: Thought about that issue today, and I’m definitely going to encourage no matter what that the pg. 42 chart be heavily used. I’m thinking though that in the case of Shoving and similar where there’s a power and just a generic move, there’s a “non trained” penalty where you don’t get the half level bonus unless the GM rules that it’s appropriately cinematic. On first blush I like the idea a lot but I’ll have to think about it more.
CharlesWK: I purposely wanted to shift the focus away from direct attack/combat powers (and some classes aren’t combat classes particularly) but maybe I swung the balance too far and need to toss in some more direct powers. I don’t mind making the basic attacks more relevant, but maybe they don’t need to be the only solution.
Shove, Grapple and Trip are all Str vs Ref. Should one of them maybe be Str vs Fort?
Aim seems way too good for the Fast hero. Sacrificing a move action is worth it for a class that uses ranged weapons and is good at moving in the first instance. It will be spammed, heavily. Another example of where Fast/Dex proves to be too broad for its own good.
Also, I agree that the kickers don’t seem balanced, as some classes have more than others AND some classes have a better variety than others (e.g. Fast heroes have great variety…Strong heroes not so much).
Plus, who in their right mind would take a power if they don’t qualify for at least 1 of the kickers?
It’s fine to change up 4e this much, afterall D20modern was a pretty big departure from 3e.
I envision again very generic base classes, with some really juicy multiclass feat options. You’re generally less single-attribute limited (D20M, dex was an uberstat!) which really opens up the build possibilities.
I can certainly see a few balance passes on the at-wills as presented here, giving them value that someone will actually use one in place of a basic attack. I like the idea of your selection of at-wills being based on fighting style as opposed to class, I’d like to see it expanded to encounter, utility and daily powers that can be chosen by all classes, with a few class-specific ones. Classes will come with their own special powers (perhaps a choice based on build: Is your fast hero agile or precise?) to differentiate them. I like this idea.
This is just a sampling of at-wills, not nearly all of them. There will be an equal number for each class to choose from. Some combos will probably have more than others, but each stat will have the same number (currently 18, but I would expect there to be more by the end.)
So far, Per Scene/Per Session are all specific to class but I might go further and completely adopt “skill powers” like PHB3 that just need to be trained in a skill to get.
It seems to me that judging class balance is a bit premature, as TheGame said this is just a sampling of powers. I also think the most difficult thing to internalize while examining these design notes is the (attempted) paradigm shift in the game: its not just all about combat. So, yes Strong, Fast, and Tough heroes probably will be better combatants than their mental counterparts, but unlike 4E that won’t limit them or make them feel less useful.
You could try and implement more powers to differentiate strong heroes from tough heroes. Right now they both seem focused on melee-oriented powers. And these might not be at will powers, but you could have a ‘shield other’ or ‘guard’ power for the tough hero, and you could have a ‘throw anything’ power for the strong hero (letting him pick up a random object and throw it at a bad guy – happens all the time in action movies).
I also think there should be some attack powers for the heroes apart from just basic attacks. Perhaps a second type of at-will?